O/T - General Politics thread

Re: O/T - General Election

Lewi7 15 Dec 2019 21:52 pm said..

Turkey want to join & have done so for years. They adopt pretty much all new EU laws anyway. The UK won't sign any new trade deal directly with Turkey (or San Marino & Andorra ) as they are so linked to EU laws and practices anyway.

But in the late 80's Maggie opposed Turkeys accession to the EU, as a result Turkey imposed a £5 visa on all UK nationals entering the country, that figure is now £20 (although if you are going, pay for it in USD $, it's cheaper).

Greece also will not consider Turkey joining until Cyprus is resolved & Turkey hands back the North of the island & even then they'll find reasons to oppose.
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Re: O/T - General Election

Severus 15 Dec 2019 22:48 pm said..

Lewi7 wrote:Remain, were very clear that it was a once in a lifetime vote & would be honoured, in 2016, before the Ref, then many remainers did their damnedest to stop Brexit.

We were told, by many in the establishment & with £9M of tax payers money (on Gov leaflets) that we would see disaster just for voting to leave - which has turned out to be complete rubbish.

As for people not knowing what they were voting for, an accusation laid before leavers, by remainers, I think this absolutely applies to remainers more. Very very few know what is contained in the Lisbon Treaty; how the EU Parliament & Commission works.

The Electoral Commission; the Supreme Court; The Speaker at the time; former PM's etc all went out their way.

The results for the Ref in '16; '17 Election; Euro Elections & '19 Election is or should be, more than clear enough for people to accept.

Feck me Lewi I’ve red some rubbish on this board over the years but that must take the biscuit.
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Re: O/T - General Election

Gloucester Mute 15 Dec 2019 23:47 pm said..

All is effectively said and done - however you twist and turn the figures.

UK is leaving Europe. Period.
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Re: O/T - General Election

JamesK 16 Dec 2019 06:15 am said..

Indeed Mute. For better or worse it is happening. Let’s hope that means Lewi will stop with his silly propaganda now. Brexit is now in the hands of the Brexitiers. They will take the credit or blame for how it turns out.
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Re: O/T - General Election

Fat Taff 16 Dec 2019 06:44 am said..

JamesK wrote:Indeed Mute. For better or worse it is happening. Let’s hope that means Lewi will stop with his silly propaganda now. Brexit is now in the hands of the Brexitiers. They will take the credit or blame for how it turns out.

Yep, it's time for the Brexit victors, as promised, to deliver the land of milk and honey.

As normal service returns today I wait with bated breath for the announcement of the schedule of delivery of forty spanking new hospitals. Timeline, budget, location, the actual detail bit of the promises in the sound bite. Its reasonable to assume it will be the same as the council house promise last time round.
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Re: O/T - General Election

SirHenry 16 Dec 2019 08:42 am said..


No one is disputing that we are leaving, as FT says it is now down to the government you voted for to deliver on all the promises.

Each day during the election we had new promises, NHS is not for sale... drug prices will not rise. It is crystal clear that the US have this as a starting point in trade negotiations.

Do you want that?

If not, do you think Johnsons government will resist? At what point will we be told?

If you voted Leave or voted Conservative and don't want that version of the future what are you now going to do about it?

Genuinely interested in your answers as we need to look forward not backwards to make Brexit work for everyone.

I guess we all know the privitisation of NHS services has been going on for some time now.

What are your NHS service "Red Lines"?
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Re: O/T - General Election

Herefordpropforward 16 Dec 2019 09:22 am said..

Look there is no point in continuing to beat ourselves up over the outcome. We live in a democracy and we must respect the will of the people as expressed in a democratic parliamentary election - as opposed to any outcome from those funny old referendum things. I believe with a passion that folk will come to regret the election outcome but that’s my take and anyway it is part of democracy. I visited my native Pembrokeshire over the weekend to hand out cards and presents etc to neighbours and to offer early Christmas greetings - with my wife in a care home they all wanted updates etc. When our conversation turned to politics, to a man and woman they had all voted for “Boris - good bloke who will save the country”. Where the NHS was letting them down - “ All the fault of that Labour Party”. The issue going forward is perhaps how we make sure that our people have accurate information so that informed democratic decisions can be made. Voting has become an emotive and irrational action which helps no one. It’s no use blaming the media because they deal with what they are fed by the politicians and spin merchants. We see it in rugby with coaches increasingly skilled at planting false messages for failure which are then parroted on fan sites etc. Incidentally my share portfolio is doing nicely since Thursday - so let them brexiters eat cake :lol: :roll: :D
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Re: O/T - General Election

Ken Burney 16 Dec 2019 09:47 am said..

HPF ... your share portfolio is probably having another good day, so far, today!
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Re: O/T - General Election

lucifer 16 Dec 2019 10:02 am said..

"The issue going forward is perhaps how we make sure that our people have accurate information so that informed democratic decisions can be made."

I wish you well with that one HPF. Given the majority of voters, including several on here, 'knew' that Jeremy Corbyn was a 'cretinous, anti- Semitic, racist, Marxist terrorist, devoid of leadership skills' without having either met him or read the background information, it would seem the media do a pretty effective job of putting across their own version of events without much need for either accuracy or impartiality.
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Re: O/T - General Election

King Prawn Bhuna 16 Dec 2019 10:08 am said..

I tend to not say too much on this as I'm very much a Europhile, mainly through a career very much regulated by European law and its variants and being open minded whilst travelling abroad

But to be a Europhile my stance has changed from being a staunch remain voter to a desire to exit Europe in a fashion that's good for our country in a practical fashion without the jingoism and xenophobia stirred up by the right wing elements.

Interesting comments during election night about how BoJo no longer has to rely on the hard line Brexiteers (ERG/DUP) and has the luxury of exiting Europe in a very strong fashion thta could result in the next phase well exceeding the 12 month schedule.

Maintaining strong commercial, education and research ties ...whilst negotiating selective access in terms of borders, asylum and laws. Whilst maintaining the right to our own laws many are already international and necessary to make the entire world go round such as banking, insurance, data protection etc.,

So we stay closely aligned for 12 months whilst trade starts to get negotiated...but personally I think it will be a long time before you will notice much difference at all...visa exemptions in the Schengen area although as current we will still have the same passport checks.

But as ever there is one helluva lot to sort out still if they think we'll leave by end of January 2020....

Will I be allowed duty free back from Toulouse and will I still be allowed to use the EU passport channel... ;)

I'd love to agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong....
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