South Africa v England part II

Re: South Africa v England part II

Cherryade 17 Jun 2018 05:42 am said..

A lot of gripes about England and some justified....but hang on, SA in my mind played pretty bloody well!....for most of the match dominant upfront, quick ball at the break down, up in our faces in defence, quick hands and good decision making with the 3/4's....England could have played better but they would still having been playing a much improved Bok team with real fire in their bellies.....I think most teams would have lost to them playing like that yesterday.

England are in a poor run but there are still some good players in that team.....and tbh there are not really that many alternatives?....
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Re: South Africa v England part II

Forrester 17 Jun 2018 07:47 am said..

SA played ok but we lost that game through our own errors. Brainless penalties, poor decision making, not taking points that are on offer and an inability to catch the flipping ball. When we hold on to it and are accurate we look as dangerous as we have for a couple of seasons. The problem seems to be that basic skills and discipline are collapsing under pressure.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

Cherryade 17 Jun 2018 08:10 am said..

They played better than ok.....but I see your point about our errors, which clearly didn't help, but a good proportion of these were caused by the SA team being all over us.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

steckers 17 Jun 2018 09:14 am said..

England are obviously in a bad place - but I don't think major overhaul is needed. Just a few tweaks. With the exception of 9 I think the backs are ok - although I would give Cipriani a game at 10 next week (there almost seems consensus on this which means EJ will go with Ford!)

England have scored 5 very good tries in last few games.

I am concerned about the pack. The English game is built upon dominance up front and at set piece. Hartley's return will help. I think a few players are tired or not fully fit.

Also, generally there is very little skill/dynamism in the pack. The only players that could address that in short term are Sam Simmonds and Isiekwi.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

kentishglaws 17 Jun 2018 09:33 am said..

I think if England nose dive in the autumn then we might see Eddie gone, whether or not that’s the right call I do not know. England played well in parts, but the unforced errors, the stupid off the ball stuff, the “Nathan ‘Where’s my brain’ Hughes” type moments really cost us that, Saffas were solid, but nothing special. Something is not right, opitomised by the Ben Young’s interview at the end.

Eddie may well have shot himself in the foot. We’ve all seen what a new coach and voice can do to a squads performance, look at his first 2 years. The RFU may decide to go that route and hope we peak for the RWC.

Personally I think we can turn it round as long as he starts picking form players, in their proper positions, and also picks players based on their intelligence, not just because they’re big and beefy, we need smart players. Simmonds etc deserve better.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

Fat Taff 17 Jun 2018 09:43 am said..

Beeb reporting that Angry Mike and Marylebone had a sweary shout at supporters.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

The Shuthonger One 17 Jun 2018 11:51 am said..

Billy Vunipola returning home with broken arm!
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Re: South Africa v England part II

TheOptimistSenior 17 Jun 2018 12:17 pm said..

Both Stephen Jones, in the Sunday Times and Tom Fordyce, on the BBC Sport website, are alluding to problems within the England camp, not just players. I agree that Ben Young's interview after yesterdays game indicated that something is wrong.
Stephen Jones makes a very good point, that there is a view that Eddie Jones is far too obsessive as a coach, trying to do too much, too often without allowing time for "absorption" - I am paraphrasing his words.
With the departure of Paul Gustard, I wonder if there is discontent among the coaches as well?
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Re: South Africa v England part II

ryno_chelt 17 Jun 2018 14:25 pm said..

Ignoring the question marks over coaching capability, form etc.

What I do know is how I feel personally - which is less patriotic than usual. It's a combination of his arrogance, weird team selections, media style and the call up of Francis and Shields who (ignoring views on their capabilities) haven't really earnt the right to wear the English Rose on their personal view is that they absolutely have to show their ability in the English premiership at least.
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Re: South Africa v England part II

Beddis 17 Jun 2018 14:30 pm said..

Jim Hamilton mentioned that some of the England players weren't overly happy with Jones in the rugby dungeon podcast a week or so ago. Presumably one of his former team mates at Sarries???
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